Speaker 1: 0:14

Hey everybody, welcome back to the Son of a Blitch podcast. I'm your host, George Blitch, and guys, you're going to love this podcast. I just wrapped up a conversation with Lieutenant Colonel Scott Mann, retired Green Beret officer, who is just an absolute gem of a human being. He has done so much for our country and so much for people in general as far as his leadership approach, sharing his stories, advising others to share their stories and to connect others to share their stories and to connect. You know, we talk a lot about this idea of the churn that is so much divisiveness and there's so much distraction, all these things that are going on in our world that is kind of dividing us, and how we need to be able to go past that, move through the churn and be able to connect with each other on, you know, these true, true heartfelt levels, to really realize that we have more things in common than we do dividing us. And I think it's very important in this, you know, set and setting in this timeline that, uh, we're talking about right now and we we really jump into a lot of that with this book. Nobody is coming to save you. A green braids guide to getting big shit done. It is a phenomenal read, uh, and he gets raw. There are some stories that are told here that are just very emotionally impactful and we unpack those today in this conversation to really explore being able to go to that depths of detail of talking about some of those ugly sides of your life in order to share those stories and maybe help other people along the way. There's many organizations he's been involved in that we talk about today. We didn't get to talk about all the books because we wanted to focus in on this one, right, but there are many books he's written. Again, everything will be in the show notes below. I highly suggest you guys go check that out. They're all phenomenal books and I think you're going to get something from all of those. And we talked about last out, uh, the play that he produced, wrote and acted in and now is going back on another tour, this first time that he won't be the lead actor, but he's obviously beginning of November. Next week we will be having the first two shows and there's going to be a lot more that will be coming up in that 2025 tour. That's, you know, kind of we're at the helm of. So if you want to see that in your city. You know there'll be links below to where you can go ahead and request that and get that going on. And again, I highly suggest you guys go check out the notes, go check out his website, scottmancom. You know I don't want to give everything away that we talked about, so I'll just leave it at that and make sure you tune in to this podcast, share it with your friends, share it with those who you think might need this, share it with your veteran community and non-veteran community.

Speaker 1: 3:00

There's something for everyone here in this conversation. I think it's very, very important. It's very uh, the timing of of this, of my interaction with Scott and, you know, releasing this uh, obviously right before the election here. I think it's very important. There's a lot going on and we really need to uh try to be able to work through the churn and connect with each other on the most human of levels, because I think that's very important right now. We need we need togetherness. We don't need divisiveness, right, we see this every single day, but we need to come together and realize that we're going to be doing better work together.

Speaker 1: 3:30

So again, thank you so much, scott, for joining me today. Thank you for all the listeners. Make sure you go check out the show notes, go check out scottmancom and make sure you order your copy of Nobody Is Coming To Save you to save you. Or check out the audio book which Scott reads, which is phenomenal. I've read it and I've listened to it Both great ways to get that in.

Speaker 1: 3:46

So, without further ado, here's the podcast with Scott Mann. You guys enjoy. Thanks, hey, scott, how you doing today? Hey, good to see you. George, thanks for having me on. Yeah, absolutely, man, listen, I definitely have a lot to talk to you about your new book, nobody Is Coming To Save you, which is phenomenal. Absolutely love it. I know you have a bunch of other books. You've written a play. There's so many things I want to dive deep into, but I kind of just figured we'll start at the very beginning with a lot of my guests. I'd like to give listeners a little bit of 101 and kind of, if you can tell us a little bit about where you're born and raised and maybe kind of go ahead and thread that through. That day at the Soto shop when you were 14 and, uh, a special, uh, you know, meeting there that kind of spawned the next move in your life.

Speaker 2: 4:30

Yeah, no thanks for having me on. Um. I was born, actually, in Clifton Forge, virginia. It didn't live there long at all. Uh, mom and dad, uh, my dad was a young forester at the time and we lived in a little single wide trailer and dad was quickly transferred from there and we moved all over the southeast. George, in little logging towns, because of the nature of his job, ended up spending a good amount of time. Most of my family's from western North Carolina. So I have very deep roots in the area that was hit tragically by Hurricane Helene and a lot of my latter year influence in terms of the stuff that's in that book nobody's coming to save.

Speaker 2: 5:16

You came from my lessons in Appalachia, but a lot of my youth was spent in Arkansas, particularly a little town called Mount Ida. Farming and logging community didn't even have a stoplight, and when I was 14, green Beret walked into our soda shop and really changed my life. His name was Mark and he was just one of the coolest dudes I ever met. The way he carried himself, the way he conducted himself, and I just knew there was something about him that was different. And I think, more importantly, he sat down and took the time to talk to me as a 14-year-old grunt who was kind of invisible in that town in a lot of ways, had been bullied to some degree and just didn't fit in.

Speaker 2: 5:55

A lot of times I felt awkward. That was kind of common with moving around a lot, and Mark took the time to explain to me about what Green Berets were and special forces that's the official title and how they work by with and through indigenous people and help them stand up on their own and how different they are than all the other groups that kick in doors and do they actually they go in with 12 and they come out with 12,000. And just the notion of that sounded so romantic and appealing to me that I just romantic in the sense of adventure. You know that I just I couldn't get it out of my head and I decided right there at 14 years old that that's what I was going to do and that's what I did.

Speaker 1: 6:40

So what did that look like from that point in time obviously finishing out high school and then you decided to go in right away and go ahead and enlist what was your timeline there and kind of in your journey to become a Green Beret.

Speaker 2: 6:51

Well, I mean, I really did look at Mark a lot for how he led as a mentor and you know he was a detachment commander, a captain, at the time when I met him and he made it pretty clear to me that you Green Berets are an NCO or sergeant-based organization, but that one of the biggest honors out there is that if an SF officer, if you truly love the organization and the men who serve in it, then you can really make an effort to take care of them and be top cover for them. And I liked that and, more importantly, I just wanted to be like Mark. So I went to college. I didn't do very well. I got a degree in political science, barely enough to get commissioned at the university of central Arkansas and was commissioned into the U S army and then that began my journey.

Speaker 2: 7:37

But you know, even as a Lieutenant I you can't just go try out for special forces. You have to wait about four and a half years until you're a captain. So I went to other schools like ranger school and air assault school and I failed all of them multiple times because I was a runt and it was very difficult for me, but I just kept going back. That was one thing that my father and mom taught me was just to never quit. And so I would just keep going back, recycling, recycling, until I eventually made it. I even recycled the qualification course for special forces several times but ultimately made it, got my Green Beret.

Speaker 2: 8:11

But it was man, it was hard. I mean it was a 10-year, you know, from the time I met Mark. A 10-year journey, but certainly about five years, five, six years in the Army of just frustration and failure, until I finally was awarded that Green Beret and then assigned to 7th Special Forces Group in Fort Bragg, north Carolina or the artist formerly known as Fort Bragg. And I spent gosh 10 years there before 9-11, working in Central and South America during the 90s, which was a pretty sporty place to be.

Speaker 1: 8:44

Yeah, so you know, in in this particular book, you know again, I'll dive into some other books, cause I think it kind of leads up and it talks about a lot of the lessons. Um, you know, one of the things of perseverance you just talked about, um, you know, for those who are not familiar yet with this book, you know, can you give a little bit of background? What is that you? You know your decision on why you wanted to write this book in this period of time and what is the premise behind, and then we'll kind of dive into some more deeper questions there yeah, I mean, I appreciate that.

Speaker 2: 9:10

I think this book has been brewing inside of me for a long time. You know, I have written a lot of pieces. I look back on it and I can't really even remember writing them. I think that all of them and I think this is true for all of us in the creative space is, you know, they find their way out of us and they're gifted to us from another place, right? So I don't. I don't remember any conscious time when I just said I'm going to write this leadership book, but what did strike me was that all of my other works had been about the military and I really hadn't written.

Speaker 2: 9:42

People were asking me well, with Pineapple Express and you guys getting the Afghans out, how did you do that when you didn't have any money, resources or authority? Or, you know, how did you write and perform a play when you're not a playwright and you're not an actor? And it got produced by Gary Sinise. You know and to me that was not extraordinary, nothing about that's extraordinary it's. It's a process that I've been using for years that these Green Beret sergeants taught me of getting big stuff done when nobody's coming to help you. There's a certain approach that you can take from the bottom up to get very big things done. My wife, monty and I would talk about it. I'm like isn't that intuitive? She's like, no, that's not intuitive. There's a process that you have that is worth sharing and I call it rooftop leadership, and I have for years.

Speaker 2: 10:27

I did a TED Talk on it, but I'd never written on it, george. I'd never written on it. So about six years ago I started working on it and it's gone through so many iterations and tosses in the trash can and curse words and you know, finally, this past November, I landed on a version of it that I was very happy with. I felt like I included the stories that were right and, frankly, the times were right for it, because everyone you look there seems to be this shortcoming or failure of institutional leadership and people don't really know what to do with that. And my position is it's okay. I mean, america's gotten through times like this before because of the resilience and leadership of our people, but we're up against a new diabolical threat that I call the churn, and we'll talk about that, I'm sure. But the conditions for leadership have changed here. So I wanted to put a book out that had those Green Beret skill sets of leading when it's hard, from the bottom up and get it out there, and that was really the impetus for it.

Speaker 1: 11:31

Well, before we jump into the churn and the idea of that and kind of the main components, you know this idea of rooftop leadership. Obviously, there you're in Afghanistan you're talking about, you know, you guys getting on top of the roofs and basically defending these villages against the Taliban. But can you go ahead and maybe dive in a little bit more and kind of explain the idea of what that rooftop leadership is and how you're bringing people up with you?

Speaker 2: 11:55

Yeah, I think that to do that is to back it up a little bit and even further expound on the mission of Green Berets and when I talk about what Mark explained to me in that soda shop of how they work by, with and through indigenous people. You know, imagine a situation where you have an area in the world where terror groups are operating in these dusty villages that are under governed, dilapidated, dealing with, you know, hunger issues, food shortages, water shortages, and they basically go in there and they set up shop, much like gangs do in East LA. They take advantage of the challenges of that civil society and they manipulate it to their own, they provide some things that allow them to set up shop and then from those places they project things like 9-11 against us from these far flung, and sure you can get in there, and11 against us from these far flung, and sure you can get in there and kick the doors in and take down targets. But it's like mowing the grass, like what you really need is to enable that community to stand up against those bad actors like an antibody, and to do that you've got to live there, you've got to get in there, you've got to grow your beard out. You've got to don indigenous scarf and you've got to live among those people and, over time, inspire them to stand up on their own to defend their own community against these bad actors and then, as a secondary effect, those bad actors don't have a safe haven to project against us.

Speaker 2: 13:20

It is a very long, tough, agonizing process that is, I tell people at Green Beret and Modern Times is a combination of John Wick, lawrence of Arabia and the Verizon guy. You know, you've got to be able to take care of business at a coercive level. You've got to be able to connect, like Lawrence of Arabia, and tell stories and listen and build relationships and rapport, even when it's hard. And then the Verizon guy's always building these networks. He's always, you know, making sure that he's connected. And that's what Green Berets do. You know, even in the earliest days of Afghanistan, when they were deep in enemy territory, they were sending out transmissions that were getting read by the Secretary of Defense and translated into policy for the rest of the United States in the global war on terror. That's what I mean by the Verizon guy. They're networked and I think those you know.

Speaker 2: 14:10

So those that's what's happening in that village and it's not easy because in the beginning, most of the people in that village are in their own kind of churn. They're disconnected and disengaged and distracted and they don't trust each other because of years of conflict. And so how do you go in there and make these connections and ultimately get them to go up on the rooftops and fight for themselves? Well, you have to go up on the rooftop yourself first. When the attack comes, you go up there and you fight and you try to defend the community from these bad actors that are coming in, that have heard you're there. It's kind of like the Magnificent Seven, you know, and at first nobody goes up there, nobody's coming, it's just your guys.

Speaker 2: 14:49

And then one night there's a muzzle flash across the way on one building that's not yours, and it's a farmer that's decided to defend his home because of the rapport and the relationships that you built with him, by treating his daughter who had a medical condition. And then, two nights later, there's another muzzle flash. It's. You know, fear is contagious, but so is leadership. And by demonstrating that and building rapport when trust risk is low, over time, within a few weeks, every rooftop in the village is firing back collectively against that threat, against that churn, and that's what I call rooftop leadership the, the ability to move people up to a rooftop when it's when it's hard, and they go there not because they have to, but because they choose to, based on the relationships and rapport that you built with them. And, uh, yeah, that's it in a nutshell, man.

Speaker 1: 15:35

Well, you know you talked about too, like with the farmers there and you had a very um, a very interesting story too is kind of talking about a connection with your grandfather there too, and I know that there were some farmers there and they were kind of pulling up the earthworms thinking that they were bad, and you had a connection there. If you could maybe tell that story a little bit. It's just something that hit home for me with with your story and your grandfather and kind of your history there too.

Speaker 2: 16:00

Yeah, everything in my book is story based and you know, there's just certain tenets to rooftop leadership that I believe are really important. You know, one is recognizing that the enemy is not the Republican or the Democrat sitting across from you, it's the social conditions that we live in, it's the churn to recognizing that this thing I call the human operating system, that we are very primal creatures and that you know I look at those arrowheads behind you and that love you have of indigenous culture we are no different at a biological level than those ancestors. I mean, we are still exactly the same makeup and we have all the same tendencies, good and bad, but we've disconnected from those tendencies bad, but we've disconnected from those tendencies. And that disconnection from our past is a major problem today, particularly when we're trying to lead. And as an example of that, what I talk about in the book is that you know, when we learned as Green Berets that if you're going to lead in any environment, there's a saying in special forces is go local or go home, like if you're just going to go in and kick the door in and then get out, that is a short-term effect. If you're just going to walk the halls as a ceo and chat everybody up once a month. So you're seen, that's just a short-term effect, it's cosmetic. You've got to get in there and you've got to live and work and play among the people you serve. And it's not easy but it's necessary.

Speaker 2: 17:29

And as an example I gave, that was in rural Afghanistan I got a phone call from a captain who I was very fond of and he was a really good officer and he was concerned. He said we need to show you something. And we were doing this mission where we were village stability, where we were living out in these communities. And they had just got there and they the freshly tilled fields and the and the young men were out in a line across the field, as you can imagine, on their knees pressing and killing the earthworms with their thumbs. And you know, I'm standing there next to this captain in disbelief with my jaw on the ground, because I grew up around farming too and I'm like that's not a good idea. And he, he was a South Georgia farm boy and he's like no. And I was like what the hell's going on here? And he's like we're trying to figure it out. It took weeks to get to the bottom of this, but what we finally figured out was that these young men who had returned to their community after decades of war and civil war, they had been in refugee camps and in Afghanistan.

Speaker 2: 18:33

All of your farming, all of your animal husbandry, all of your grazing practices, all of your timber management is in an indigenous tribal society which, as you know, is oral in nature. So all of your institutional lessons for land management and responsible stewardship are passed from father to son. Well, because of all the years of war and the displacement of the elders during the Soviet occupation, most of the elders went into refuge. Most of the elders were killed Right, and those few that survived went into the refugee camps and they didn't share stories about farming practices because they figured they'd never go back. So the next generation of farmers never farmed.

Speaker 2: 19:17

And so when we went into Afghanistan the first 10 years of the war, while we're driving around throwing soccer balls out the window and, you know, encouraging people to vote, it never dawned upon us that these floods of people that were returning from Quetta, pakistan, didn't know how to farm.

Speaker 2: 19:32

We were writing up all these positive metrics about how people were returning, but they were returning to farms and to civil society realities that they didn't know how to deal with their civil society at an informal level was as broken as any ministry and formal civil society in Kabul. But we didn't know because we weren't local. So 10 years later now we're living in these outposts with the locals and we're seeing that. Oh wow, that's what it's an institutional gap in memory. So you know we did. We brought out Department of Agriculture experts and rural farmers from Oklahoma and they started helping build model farms and within a couple of months you started to see a complete change in food production in these rural areas, and most of them the areas we were. They went from subsistence to actually being able to sell their goods. And guess what? It was a direct corollary to their willingness to go up on that rooftop.

Speaker 1: 20:30

Yep man, it was a fascinating read there and your connections, and just to see how there are those gaps and you don't know what you don't know, and if that stuff is passed along the line and the generations, and all of a sudden it stops, no matter what kind of information, intelligence it is. You know these practices that they're generationally have gone back you know so many hundreds, thousands of years, and then all of a sudden there's a gap there too. So it was. I found that a very fascinating story. Let's jump back into the idea of the churn.

Speaker 1: 21:01

You know you mentioned a couple of times. You know you mentioned in the book. You say it's volatile, divisive, fear-inducing, breeds uncertainty, complex, crowded, ambiguous and so many more things. But you talk about kind of the main components of the churn. I'd love for you to kind of tell people about what it is that your belief and what you kind of define that is, and then we'll, you know, kind of go in a little bit further about how that is affecting all of us in such a mighty way on a day-to-day basis right now. Oh, man.

Speaker 2: 21:26

Yeah, no, I I'm really glad we're getting into it and it and it is important, I think, to step back in as humans and look at what's going on around us. You know, the first special operations imperative is know your operational environment, because the operational environment is always changing and it has changed under our feet like tectonic plates shifting under the earth. You know, and I think people when they look around for example in this election you look around and you see friends who went to high school together unfriending each other on Facebook over a candidate. You know, and I don't mean unfriending each other in like when you and I were kids and we're like I'm not playing with you anymore, and then the next day you go back.

Speaker 2: 22:05

Yeah, I'm talking about unfriending, like ending relationships and become a verb. You know this unfriending and we've normalized it Like it's. People do it all the time. If you don't like this post and unfriend me, it's. It is a.

Speaker 2: 22:20

It is a caustic, corrosive environment, and you see it in the way people treat each other in public. You see just the, the, the, the spew that comes out of the 24 seven news cycle, and so I call that the churn. It's this metaphorically, it's this roiling set of social conditions where it's so much harder to sell, to inspire, to lead, even to have Thanksgiving dinner or whatever your favorite holiday is, with extended family. Because there's all these things you can't talk about anymore. Civil discourse is gone, and we've normalized that to such a degree because most people are operating in this fear-based trance state that they don't even realize they're doing it. They've got their heads down in their dopamine dispensers or iPhones and they're actually pawns of these divisionist leaders that seek to advance their own narrow agenda with in-groups and out-groups, which is very primal. And so what I say is that the biggest problem, this churn, the enemy is not the Republican or the Democrat sitting across from you, it's not the mask or no mask. It is this novel, unprecedented set of social conditions that we're dealing with that we've never dealt with before, and what the leadership training we've had up to this point? What got you here is not going to get you there. It's more about. It looks a lot more like Afghanistan than it does America in many ways, and a big reason for that, george, is because you know that metaphor of the iceberg that I'm always talking about in the book, where the tip of the iceberg is the modern world and the bottom of the iceberg, the part you can't see, is the traditional world. It's the world where we all come from those arrowheads that are behind you. It's that world, but we all come from that world Like that world is not that far removed from us. Jared Diamond says that we are far more traditional than we are modern, but we've forgotten that world. We have forgotten that that's who we are, and we think that we're so advanced and so sophisticated that we're not susceptible to that primal, feudal behavior where we demonstrate in groups and out groups and contempt. But we're very much capable of it and we're doing it without even realizing it. So those conditions are what I call the churn, and the final thing I'll say about it the way I.

Speaker 2: 24:40

The real essence of it are the four D's, which is distraction. We're disengaged. We, you know, we're so distracted, the least little thing pulls off focus. Our attention spans like eight seconds. We're so disengaged.

Speaker 2: 24:53

85% of the population claims to not have purpose at work. We're disconnected from our past and from from the natural world because our heads are down in our phone and we're distrustful. Two thirds of Americans say they don't trust their neighbor. And if you look at this election disconnection we've got going right now. I mean, I'm actually I think a lot of people are looking around going. Are we going to have civil unrest, you know, after November 5th? I mean, I never thought I would say that in my adult life in this country. So all of those things are the churn. And my point, george, is that we as leaders, as parents, as coaches, we've got to recognize that that is the enemy and that there is a way to lead through it. But just doing it on instinct and just doing it on, you know, uh, winging it is not going to get it. You're going to actually get sucked into the churn with everybody else.

Speaker 1: 25:44

Well, and you talk about, like, the opposite of churn is clarity. How do people, how do you uh, you know advise folks to be able to then recognize the churn, see that these things are happening, looking at those four D's and then rising above it, working through it and being able to build communities that can quiet that churn and move that away, so that we can move forward and kind of come back to that cohesiveness, that idea of that tribal nature, these indigenous communities, these, these, these connectors that you talk about and you, you mentioned in your leadership. But I'm I'm curious as far as like, okay, we have this. Here's the issue set in front of us. What is your advice to folks to be able to be able to move through that in the most fluid way?

Speaker 2: 26:26

Put, your own oxygen mask on. First right Is is recognize that we are the most emotional creatures on the planet. We navigate the world with emotion and when we get afraid or angry, which is unfortunately most of the, that's where we are most of these days. Because of the 24 seven news cycle, the economy, the social media, we stay in this in-group, out-group, fear-based, anger-based mentality and the sympathetic nervous system remains up at fight, flight or freeze and it's not supposed to stay there. That is for when there's a saber-toothed tiger in the bushes or your kids are in a burning car. It is not for when your 401k is eroding or your candidate's losing. A sympathetic response is not appropriate. We want to be in the parasympathetic state, which is calm and connect, rest and digest. Both of those are in our nervous system that are as old as those arrowheads and both are necessary. But in the modern world, a lot of these divisionist leaders and social media and 24-7 news corporate media they have fomented a circumstance where we are in the sympathetic state of fight, flight or freeze all the time. There's always a tiger in the bushes and that's not one, it's not healthy, but two. It's not appropriate for leading your kids or having a discussion at Thanksgiving and you end up surrendering your agency. As Dr Ivan Terrell says, anger makes you stupid, right, because you surrender your higher intelligence functions of the frontal cortex. They shut down because you're in survival mode. So what I say is put your own oxygen mask on first. You've got to, we've got to change your state. You've got to get yourself down to a parasympathetic state of calm and connect where you're open and you're ready to actually assess your environment and you look like you trust yourself right, ready to actually assess your environment, and you look like you trust yourself right. And that means you've got to practice self-leadership in that moment, the best way to do that.

Speaker 2: 28:22

I remember when I was operation center director in Kandahar, afghanistan in 2005, and we had a chopper go down and had my best friend on it and a bunch of team guys that I love dearly, and they were just spewedwed, spewed all over the battlefield and I didn't know how many were dead, how many were alive. It was a show and um, I was terrified and but, and everybody in the operation center was looking at me. It was like your worst nightmare realized, and what I ended up doing was I. I said, give me a second. I literally stepped outside, um, I did like 10 burpees and I did diaphragmatic breathing, three horizontal breaths, and asked myself a couple of questions what can I control, what can I not control? And then I walked back in the operation center and I was in a state where I could actually navigate the situation, and that became something that could be mirrored, because fear is contagious, but so is leadership. And so what I say and I just did a LinkedIn newsletter on this this morning I believe putting your own oxygen mask on first means, first of all, immediately disengage from whatever event just triggered you.

Speaker 2: 29:30

If it's social media, put the dadgum thing down. If it's 24-7 news, turn the Fox News off. Quit having it run in the background. Turn the alerts off on your phones during election season, you don't need them ever, but turn them off now. Do a digital detox the moment you start to see yourself get worked up. Then go move. Dr Tyrrell says that movement and meaning are inextricably linked. Go do burpees. Dr Tyrrell says that movement and meaning are inextricably linked. Go do burpees, walk around the block, go play with your kids and do breath work, do three to five diaphragmatic breaths, you know, and then go back into the situation. Just that alone, just that will reduce the sympathetic state response of probably 90% of the stuff we deal with during the election and beyond.

Speaker 1: 30:22

You know you mentioned the digital detox and I've heard you talk about this before in the different interim points throughout the year that you actually do that. Can you go ahead and maybe share that with listeners as far as your kind of routine with that?

Speaker 2: 30:31

Getting ready to do one and why it's important. Yep, getting ready to do one in just a week or two, a big one. And why it's important, yep, getting ready to do one in just a week or two, a big one, like a 10-day digital detox right after the election. But so I kind of you know, look these devices are. I understand the role they play in our civil society and I get it and it's part of my business, but there is a level of entanglement with these devices that our primal brains doesn't understand. And if you don't believe me, watch somebody walking down the street, walk into a lamppost or walk across a crosswalk, or see a family sitting together at a restaurant, all on their phones in each other's presence. Our prime, adam Ghazali Ghazali, says that we are ancient brains trying to make sense of a high-tech world and failing Our primal brains. Just don't. You know, multitasking is a myth. It's not true. You can't multitask. The brain works in sequence. Yet we think that we can be on this and have a meaningful conversation with our teenager, and it's not true, right? So the level of entanglement in these things and the way that they tap into our deepest primal level of of dopamine, and and and and just the need for status and so many of these other innate needs that we have. These things fill them in a very diabolical way, and that's pre-AI. So when I talk about the entanglement is what we're dealing with here, and we have to disentangle ourselves all the time. And if we don't think of it as tentacles, they just get deeper and stronger around you, and so you can cut those tentacles off and disentangle and then go back in and do what you have to do. But I believe you have to be super intentional about it. You have to know that that is indeed part of the churn and that that thing puts you in a trance-like state, it elevates your emotional arousal around fear and anger, it reduces your connection to the natural world, all of those things. So go the opposite direction with these digital detoxes.

Speaker 2: 32:40

I say, you know, at least one hour before you go to bed, turn the dadgum blue screens off. I know I don't touch my devices until 10 am. I don't even look at them, I don't roll over in bed and check. I mean I do not. I do all my rituals and then at 10 AM I'll I'll get onto those devices and even then I'll get sucked into the rabbit holes, but I try to build exercise routines and things throughout the day that remove me from them and I'll leave them in the room and then I say, like you know, maybe once a once a month or once a quarter, have a Friday that you have a no, no comms day and everybody knows it.

Speaker 2: 33:14

Those devices are shut off, and then once a quarter, a macro detox three, five days where you just put them up. And I've been doing that and I have to tell you it is one. It's increased exponentially my creativity and my ability to get more done and I just, I just feel better. I mean I really do. I, once I get past the jonesing of that thing being out of my hands for a little while, I feel better and I just think we're going to have to get more and more deliberate and intentional about techniques and procedures for the digital detox, particularly as AI makes its way into our world, or we're going to become so entangled that it doesn't end well for our species. I don't think.

Speaker 1: 34:01

Well, and that's something, too, that I've noticed whenever, you know, especially when I have my entire family around me because, you know, I got two daughters and the idea of, like that, if I need to get that phone call, if it ever comes through right, there's like this tethered feeling that I have. But when we're all together, we're at the ranch or wherever on vacation, the idea that that phone can go and sit in a drawer and we just connect the. The level of authentic connection that I have with people when phones are down is something that there's no second you know place to. That it's incredible and there's so many things you can learn about people when you put those down.

Speaker 1: 34:37

When somebody hears that, you know they, they, immediately it's like our Pavlov's dogs. Like you know, we go to that, like we have to get it and it's like it's so false sometimes. Oh, okay, someone wants to sell you something you know that was important to break a you know true connection, a time with someone else and, uh, you know that distraction is this there every single day. It's more part of the churn and I, I hear you, man, the detox is very valuable.

Speaker 2: 35:01

Yeah, and I talked about it in the book and I give some suggestions. My favorite one, though, is the when the phone hits the floor of the airplane and even the little three-year-old baby's like was that mine? You know it's like it's, it's, it's synchronized swimming, swimming. It's the only piece of kit that we carry that. If it hits the floor of an airplane, everybody on the plane knows what it was and they wonder if it was theirs. Any other piece of kit hits the floor.

Speaker 1: 35:23

No one cares oh, it's so true. You know what I want to kind of, you know, turn into another direction real quick, because in this book you talk about something that was very personal, powerful, um and uh, just really, and when you coming forth and sharing, and that was what happened back in 2015. And you kind of mentioned that you have a TED talk that you're going to and you had this idea of what you're going to write and you spoke with someone about you know, realizing your true, authentic voice and self. And then you realized, hey, I need to change what I want to you know, prepare and share on this TED talk. And then you realized, hey, I need to change what I want to you know, prepare and share on this Ted talk, and if you can kind of bring us through that journey and what it was that made you want to share this story, how you went about it and how you included your family and conversations and what that, that turning point for you.

Speaker 2: 36:12

Uh, if you don't mind diving into that a little bit, yeah, you know, it was two years after I transitioned from the army in 2013. And I thought I had the world by the tail. You know, I was the high performing Green Beret. I had done all these cool missions and I was retiring on my terms. I didn't like where things were going in the army with Afghanistan and I felt like there was more for me to do on the outside than the inside. And I was going to write a book. My kids were still at home, my marriage was still there and, within you know, a few days of taking off those desert boots and putting on the Tampa Bay flip-flops, I started to experience the snakes in my head squirming on a massive level and, by 18 months later, I had become devoid of purpose. I'd lost my passion for everything. I was walking around my house in a bathrobe I'm not even knowing the last time I'd showered. My boys would get up and leave the room because they didn't know what version of dad they were going to get, and it was a really, really dark time, george. I mean, it was a time when I felt like I was no longer relevant, and that's the worst feeling in the world. And and uh, I I started um, planning and and and preparing for, you know, taking my life, and just because I, just I, I I had, and, and it was really initiated by, uh, the levels of division at home. I didn't have a word, the churn at that time, but it was this just, everybody was so divided and you know, to come back from multiple tours in combat and see people treating their neighbor with the contempt that we treated the Taliban or Al Qaeda, or worse, and you're like what the hell was this, even for you know, and and you start to question everything and, um, everything was just so, uh, divisive and I just like, well, I don't even, I don't even know what this, what was the most point of leaving, losing all those friends? What was the point of everything? I gave up my marriage is now almost gone for what you know and it allowed all of that stuff, that the survivor's guilt, the moral injury, that PTS that were endemic to me from the war, to just ravage. And so I almost, you know, I went into the closet and almost took my life.

Speaker 2: 38:33

And it wasn't the only time that I went into that closet, that day that I described in the book, there were other times. That was the closest I ever came, and it was my hands were shaking I mean, they still shake when I talk about it now and and but you know, I emerged from that really just, you know, in almost in a, in a, in a transition purgatory, you know, where I couldn't live and I couldn't die, and I just didn't know what I was, I was supposed to do, and I, for grace of God, I mean I found storytelling as a modality to heal myself, as a, and then as a way to heal others and help others heal themselves, and then to bridge gaps, like what you and I are doing right now. I mean, look at how fast we bridged, you know we met for the first time and then, just looking at your Arrowhead connection and listening to your story of how you got into that, it like took me right in and there's all these connections, and I found that and it saved my life. It didn't change my life, like it. I mean it saved my life, you know, and and I was so grateful for that that I thought this is what I'm gonna do the rest of my life. I'm going to pursue storytelling as my way of giving back to the world and and doing my part.

Speaker 2: 39:46

And so when I had gone to this TED talk I was already it was my third one. You know how you get like I've got this this is a great, nice vanilla topic on leadership and I had just lost another friend to suicide. And so I was sitting there watching these other TED Talks and it wasn't the one I was speaking at, but I was there as a coach and I was watching them and I thought I can't do this. I can't get up on that stage and not talk about what just happened to my friend and what almost happened to me. So I told Monty that I needed to change my talk.

Speaker 2: 40:21

I think it was like three weeks before the talk and I've never said this to her. But I want to thank the organizer of that Ted Talk, kimberly, because she didn't have to let me do that change and she did and she trusted me and I'm grateful that she did that. Ted Talk has got over like a billion views and I think it's helped a lot of people. I've had a lot of people tell me that they were in that closet, and so that's kind of a long description there. But that day was a very profound day for me because it was the darkest of my my scars but it ended up being the one that has probably been the most generous sure in repurposing and helping people well and I I see how helpful that can be.

Speaker 1: 41:05

And just you being so brutally and raw of your honesty. You know there are so many veterans who that transition out and all of a sudden there's a lack of the brotherhood, sisterhood, that kind of community they're spinning. I mean, I've talked to so many of them, your story your closet, I've had multiple conversations, I've worked a lot of different veterans and veteran organizations and support groups and really trying to emphasize mental health. This will be the first podcast in my veteran month. Forget veteran day, the veteran month, right, there's so many other people who have their time.

Speaker 1: 41:40

I want to make sure that I do as much as I can to raise awareness for these people who have sacrificed all you know and, uh, it's, it's something that's so important to me to key in on and I I love it when I hear people talk about being there, because I think then other folks who are going through that struggle they can identify with that and so many do and you know, with so many that we lose every single day.

Speaker 1: 42:04

It's, it's something that I really want to, you know, bring awareness to the idea of like. Also, when you got to that point too, and you realize that storytelling was going to be a healing part of your journey and for others. I'm curious, though, like, how did you make that transition from that day to then realizing that, going and telling your story? Like, what help did you get in order to be able to kind of take to that next step and move forward? Because I'm you know, when people get to these points in their life, a lot of times they need those helping hands or those platforms, those organizations, and I was curious about, like what it was your, your, your path through that fire, and if you could maybe talk about that a little bit.

Speaker 2: 42:48

Yeah, happy to. I you know, and you're, you're right, we're coming into, as we're recording this, we're coming into. You know it's November, I don't know if you do this, but November is also the month of the military family, and you know. So our whole military community just has so much to offer, and I want to reiterate that to anyone listening to this. If you're a civilian and you're wondering how do I help, you know the veteran community, how do I? One of the things that I think we need to shift our mindset on 20 years after the longest war, or 20 year war, and then three years after the ending of that war, our veteran population in our military community, in my assessment, and our first responders are a national treasure about the churn that we're in and what we could possibly be going through, not to mention the fact that I think there's a very high likelihood of a catastrophic complex terror attack on the united states in the next two years. I really do, and I'm not going to get into that now, but what I will tell you is, if you look at how our veterans operate and how they lead, they are the most highly suited leaders for the times that we're in in this country. I mean we need them at every level. We need them in politics, we need them in corporate America, we need them leading our communities, coaching our travel ball teams. I'm not saying they're the end-all be-all, but I'm saying these are men and women that we dropped into Iraq and Syria and Afghanistan. Syria and Afghanistan that even a private in the 82nd airport, at 18 years old, was dealing with diabolical civil society situations that would make most seasoned diplomats spit up a hairball. And these young men and women are out there right now staring at a bottle of Jack and a 45 or medicating on Oxy or or just wondering was it even worth it? And I'm not saying all of them, but like it is more than it is more than just ending veteran suicide, it is more than just getting these men and women, it's getting them back in the game, because we need them leading us here at home. I think they're our last best hope for this country. And so to your question.

Speaker 2: 44:57

You know civilians, I believe, play a critical role in the reintegration of the military community back into civil society, in your ability to connect deeply with your neighbors who are veterans, with your coworkers, in your ability to hear their stories without judgment and then to walk that path with them into the next level, into the next ridgeline at their shoulder. It's more than just thank you for your service. It's like looking and listening and going. Okay, let's walk that path, get you over these couple of bumps so that you can lead me.

Speaker 2: 45:33

And so what happened was an example of that was a buddy of mine, who was a business owner, heard my story, what I was going through, didn't tell him about the closet, but that I knew I was relevant. I knew that I was looking around at this society that was so broken and divided and distrustful. And here I had done my whole life in places like that. I'd learned how to build rapport, do active listening. You know to lead through tough times, and I could teach corporate leaders how to do that.

Speaker 2: 46:01

But every time I would try and I would tell stories about it, it would get stuck in my throat and I would have this anxiety. And he said you need to go study with Bo Eason. You need to go study with Bo Eason, former NFL football player, turned actor, turned playwright, turned storyteller, and he helps people like you do this. So I did. I had nothing to lose. I flew out to California and I watched Bo on stage and, george, I'm telling you, like nobody in that room moved when this guy was on the stage. I mean, we were breathing in unison and it was for me it was like seeing Mark in the soda shop again. And I went up to him afterwards, I elbowed my way past everybody. I think he thought I was stalking him it probably was and I explained to him, you know, with some urgency, who I was and what I was doing, and he just looked at me and he said I'm going to help you. And he did.

Speaker 2: 46:52

For two years that man poured himself into me and he showed me the elements of storytelling that are the primal, physical aspects, the breath work, how to really bring your story alive, how to take those scars, like the closet and men that I lost, and turn them into narratives that were actually helpful to other people, what I call the generosity of scars.

Speaker 2: 47:13

Then that ignited for me a passion where I started studying with indigenous storytellers around the world. I started studying under other coaches, I started studying acting, I wrote a play. All of those things that came out came from that couple of those handful of civilians who said we're going to help you, here's what, here's, let's do this, and and then all of a sudden I was loose and I was back to being that high performer that I knew how to be, and I still am. So that was my journey with it, and it's not unique. I don't think there's anything unique about what I just said. Storytelling for me was my modality, but there's a range of ways that civilians and veterans and military family members can work together to move through that dark stuff and get on the other side of it. And then we turn them loose to lead us here at home because they know how.

Speaker 1: 48:07

Amen, man, thank you for sharing that, and you know there's so many valuable lessons that come through this book and the idea of being generous with your scars, I think, is so important that we can share that and really connect with people on that true heartfelt level of what we're going through and how we. There's so many things that we have. There's more things that we have in common right than the divides, but we have to be able to sit down and look at that and see that, rid ourselves of the distractions and realize that we can all come together and work together and build something better. It's all there for us.

Speaker 1: 48:41

But I think so many times the blinders are on, whether it's the phone or the screen, or the distractions or the chaos, the noise. I mean, like you even talked about in the book too. You know there's the group in the middle right. There's like two thirds of the people that are sitting there in the middle that are collectively there, and then you have this other third, these, you know, the sixth on the, on the edges. That are the ones that are the so much noise and distraction to us. But really we have so much more that holds us together and I think that that's something that it's very important for us to take note of.

Speaker 2: 49:08

I agree that, uh, more in common calls them the exhausted majority. Um, there is this study that I recommend anybody watching this podcast check it out. You can just Google it. It's called the Hidden Tribes of America and it was one of the sources for my book Towards the End.

Speaker 2: 49:25

When I talk about better days and the upswing and it's a really good read I mean it's almost unbelievable to think that two thirds of our country are this exhausted majority in the middle, who really have a propensity to work together, who really are tired of all the spew and the churn. And then, all of a sudden, it's exciting because two thirds is a super majority in any in any democracy. Two thirds is a super majority in any in any democracy. Two thirds is a super majority. You could literally vote out every divisionist leader on both sides of the aisle, every institutionalist who seeks to take away our agency, and we can reclaim a lot through the electoral process if we can just look inward and recognize that it starts with us. But there are a whole bunch of people to your left and to your right looking to connect. They just and to go up on that rooftop. They just need one person to do it.

Speaker 1: 50:32

Absolutely. I definitely suggest people dive into that, and you'll learn more about it in the book too. Another story that I'd love for you to kind of share is that of the stay in step and the CI recovery center. I just love the idea too. You got Simon Magata, the senior executive from Toyota, and you know if you could kind of maybe you know, build that up as far as what it was why you were getting involved in wanting to help, you know, bring this facility about. And then just the story of that walkthrough and how powerful that was.

Speaker 2: 51:01

Yeah. So you know I like to bring in stories in this book that really show there's no reason for you to not fulfill on what it is that's keeping you up at night. And if you don't believe me, um, there's a story in the book about a green beret named Romy, who's one of my best friends, who was shot through the neck, uh in Afghanistan and really never should have made it out of that Valley. But his best buddy, um, did a tracheotomy on him in the back of the vehicle under fire moving backwards through a riverbed and then breathed for him for a an hour or longer and helped him, uh, stay alive and and just that. That story's not even in the book. That story of how they saved his life, brought, brought him home, is epic and um and but Romy was paralyzed from the shoulders down, he was on a ventilator and they didn't think that he would. Um, his wife Gabby, who they've known each other since they were 14 in Venezuela they gave each other their first kiss at 14 in Venezuela and, um, she learned of Romy's injury on her birthday and she grabbed her 18-month-old son, andres in Fayetteville and drove up to Walter Reed and, you know, stayed at his side for months and then I was working at the agency and I got called over and I was there when he was in that hospital in those first moments, and no one thought he would make it, except Gabby, if you were crying when you walked in the room, romy's room should throw you out because there was no crying allowed in the room. Because she said all he can't move his head, so all he can see is your eyes and he can't see fear. We have to be strong. That was where her head was Right. We have to be strong. That was where her head was Right. So, um, now fast forward. Uh, several years later, and they moved to Tampa where we lived, grace of God, and they went to the James A Haley spinal cord injury. Uh, and you know, the reality was they, they.

Speaker 2: 53:10

He was still paralyzed from the shoulders down, he still had a diaphragmatic stimulator. So he has, during the day, he can breathe on his own, but think aboutator. So he has, during the day, he can breathe on his own, but think about it, like he has to think about every breath he takes. Can you imagine doing that all day long, actually constantly thinking about your breath, and he does that, and then, um, and then he they convinced the department of defense to do a stem cell surgery on him in Portugal that might give him a chance to walk again. It didn't, except that it gave him feeling back in his extremities uh, hot and cold. It regulated his ability to deal with urinary tract infections and things like that, and so there, but to for it to work he had to work out. He had to do a lot of physical exercise and with assisted weight lifting and things like that, and of course, as a scuba guy on a team, he loved that stuff. So, but when it was time for him to retire because they kept him on active duty through all this, he knew that he was going all the way across from Tampa to Orlando to do this twice, three times a week to do these intense workouts.

Speaker 2: 54:13

And it was making a difference, because most spinal cord injury people like Christopher Reeve, they atrophy and they pass, and the insurance system doesn't really keep them going. And so Gabby and Romy knew if Romy went into medical retirement from the military, that was it, that he would atrophy, and so they wanted to open their own spinal cord injury center. They invited me over for dinner we were dear friends and then, uh, basically ambushed me with the request to be the chairman of the board and I'm like, do we even have a board? And they're like, well, the three of us. So, yeah, yeah, three start, yeah. And but you know what? That's how it started. It started at their kitchen table and I went home and I was in tears because I told my wife you know, I'm like I'm going to fail them, you know, because I have no clue what I'm doing and she looked at me in her true special forces wife style, said baby, when has that ever stopped you from anything? And so we just started. We just started and we just started building connections and making building relationships.

Speaker 2: 55:24

And at some point we brought some other people on the board. But we told the story, george. We told their story and they told their story. We would take him to New York, we would fly him to LA, and it was so difficult having to lift him in and out of those seats and so hard on him but we did. And at some point we ended up with a 5,000 square foot facility with no furniture or anything and we were about to be foreclosed on.

Speaker 2: 55:48

And Nagata, we got word that Simon Nagata from Toyota was in town and wanted to talk to some veterans, so we convinced them to come to that piece of crap building with no furniture and no exercise equipment. And we turned Gabby loose on him and she she went in as they were walking off. Romy looks at me and he's like he's toast and uh, within minutes she, she had completely painted the vision of this place and he bought it and a six-figure donation came in. Within months we were opened and now they're in a 10,000-square-foot facility they have. Hundreds of people have come through there.

Speaker 2: 56:32

Three veterans have learned to walk again. People have come through there. Three veterans have learned to walk again. They are really setting. There's now interns from, I think, a University of Central Florida, south Florida, from PT, that come in there and work. You've got to see it. It's unreal. I would encourage anybody to go to stayinsteporg and watch the video. Donate to what these people are doing. Romy is usually out there on the floor working out to this day with still can't move below his shoulders. It is. If you, if you think that you can't get big stuff done when nobody's coming, spend three minutes at stay in step. But I'll end on this. It all came down to every single thing that's in that book Human connection, purpose, storytelling and struggle and emotion. Those are the realities and if you just tap into those and build social capital around that, there's no ceiling for what you can do, and Romy and Gabby proved it. They still do.

Speaker 1: 57:27

Yeah, thank you for sharing that. That was a profound part of this book. There's many times where I've just had to put it down because there's so many emotional moments you sharing, you sharing what happened there. You know in your home this story and so many others. I mean it's it's a very, very powerful book. I think everyone should go and read it. I'll have the links in the show notes. You guys make sure you go check this out. It's phenomenal. I mean you have a lot of other books that people can go and check out and we'll we'll have all the links down there below. You know another thing that's coming out. You got some other Last Out. You got some more productions of the play. If we can go ahead and before we sign off, if you can talk a little bit about that and you know what's coming up, so we can kind of, you know, let some people know about that.

Speaker 2: 58:06

Yeah, absolutely, thank you. So the Last Out play is a play you'll read it in the book if you haven't already but it's about a modern Green Beret and his family trying to navigate the wickets of war, and it's meant to educate civilians on the impact of war while simultaneously healing and validating those who lived it using storytelling. All the cast members are veterans and military family members. It's in its third tour. We're about to start our third touring season. I am excited to say it is a brand new cast and for the first time, I'm not in it. I'm the executive producer. But the cast is phenomenal. They are so good I can't say enough about them. I mean, I don't want to say too much because I want people to go see it. So here's the thing we're going to be performing the play November 6th in Tampa. November 8th in Danville, kentucky. If you go to lastoutplaycom, you can get tickets there, but we're putting the season together for 2025 right now and we're going to do at least 12 tour stops in 2025.

Speaker 2: 59:09

If you want the play to come to your town, reach out to me, scott, at scottmancom, and let me know. You know, uh, let me know that you'd like to bring the play, uh and we'll, you know we'll talk about it. It's about a I think it's about a 20k lift to get it out to different locations, um and but it's powerful man and uh, we've been doing it for three years now and and people love it. It's so raw and emotional and we do a talk back afterwards. I'll be at every show so we'll have a chance to meet and I just recommend it for any community.

Speaker 2: 59:44

George, I'm telling you it is so good for our communities in this time of churn to have this play come to your town. It's good for local veterans, it's good for military families, the families that have lost people, vietnam veterans who feel forgotten, and then just civilians who want to learn more. I just can't say enough about it. Maybe we can get it to Houston. Man, I'm going to make a pitch tonight at this veterans event to bring it to Houston. So I'd like to stay in touch with you on just you know what we can do.

Speaker 1: 1:00:12

Oh, I'd love to do anything I can to get that and I think there's there, we know, substitute going seeing that person. But if people do, right now they have some interest and they want to go and check out. There are some film productions of the play that they can go and see and where all can people go and check those out?

Speaker 2: 1:00:29

Thank you, Amazon prime. It's on Amazon prime, I think it's on Google Plus and Apple TV also. And again it's called Elegy of a Green Beret Sorry, Last Out, Elegy of a Green Beret. And then all proceeds of the film 100% go to our Heroes Journey storytelling program. So even if you just watch the film, you're making a huge contribution. We just showed the film George on the Special Forces Association cruise. We had hundreds of Green Berets and their families all the way back to Vietnam watching this film in this packed house and it was one of the most emotional things I've ever seen. Everybody that watched it just felt like it was their life up there. So if you're wondering about authenticity in the film and in the play, it will rock you. It will rock you, and so I encourage people to see the film and get out and see the live version.

Speaker 1: 1:01:23

Well, and for the other things you got going on, for people who want to kind of keep you know up with you know when the production schedules are going to be going on, what cities are going to be coming through next, when you might be given some you know talks about this book or maybe future ones too, how can people go ahead and and follow along this journey? Give us some websites and some socials so people can kind of join in, if you don't mind.

Speaker 2: 1:01:42

Yeah, a hundred percent. Everything that I do on my body of work is scottmancom Every, my for-profit, my nonprofit. I've recently started a Patreon site, a Scott Mann Patreon site, where, if people want to go deeper on the storytelling or like in Houston, we're going to be filming behind the scenes, with me reuniting with these Afghan commandos that I'm going to be meeting and my keynote and how I prepare for keynotes and how I recover from keynotes. A lot of people want to get you know, they want to take the nobody's coming book and go deeper. So if you want to do that, scottmanncom has tons of stuff, but Patreon is a great way to join in for the cup of coffee. You know, you can. You can hang out with me, ask questions. My podcast is there.

Speaker 2: 1:02:22

And then, finally, one other thing that I'll throw out there that's on the Scott Mann page is twice a year I run a storytelling workshop called Own Every Room and a lot of business owners, a lot of corporate professionals and nonprofits come to this to learn how to tell their story in a really powerful way. And, what's cool, it's at a dude ranch in old Florida. It's very intimate, like 50 people. I teach it personally. It's the only time that I do this, like myself, twice a year, and you will develop and rep your story over and over with partners and then around a campfire, and so it's just a really old school way to learn influence and storytelling the Green Beret approach, but where you can own a room when you walk into it. The way that I try to do it, and that's March 1st is our next one, and again scottmancom. It's there and then we'll do another one in the fall.

Speaker 1: 1:03:14

Phenomenal. I definitely encourage everyone to go check that out again. I'll have all the links in the show notes below. You know, scott, before we sign off, you know there's a question I'm very curious your take on it and that's one about legacy. You know I wanted to know is this something that you think about in your day to day life and what you're putting out, you're producing, the people you're helping and the idea of how you want to view your own legacy? Is that something that is a part in play in your day-to-day? Or is that something that you kind of look back and you're like, oh, I've contributed here, I've done this. Is that something that you think about consciously? And I'm just kind of curious your take about that 100%.

Speaker 2: 1:03:56

For both my wife Monty and me, the tracks that we leave. As my dad says it, they're everything. The impact and relevance are my two main metrics in how I navigate the world. Am I having an impact and am I relevant? Those are my metrics. Everything else is whatever I mean. It's just fuel, it's airspeed.

Speaker 2: 1:04:15

To be more impactful and more relevant, I believe that the human operating system says that we are meaning, seeking creatures. If we don't have purpose, we perish, and so the epicenter of purpose for me is legacy. What tracks am I leaving behind in my relationships with my kids, with the capacity that I build in this world to do what it does after I'm gone? So that's why I'm not in the play. I want to be in the play. I miss the play. I love that play, but my legacy and my tracks say no man, that thing needs to be traveling and doing what it does without you in it, because that's where it can do the most good. So you better believe.

Speaker 2: 1:05:02

That's how I look at the world is through the lens of leaving tracks, and I hope that more people will do that because, at the end of the day, when we, when we were at the end of our life. You know, I think the only metric that's remaining is whether we take a long breath or a short breath. You know, honestly, I think it comes down to that A long breath where we realize that we've lived a fulfilled life and a short breath of regret. And you know, I'll take the former, you know, and I believe that assessing constantly and reassessing the tracks that we're leaving, the legacy that we're leaving behind, is the best way to ensure that we get that long breath at the end of our life.

Speaker 1: 1:05:37

Well said. Thank you so much, scott, for joining me today. Is there anything that we might not have covered, or is there any special message you have to the listeners that you want to convey before we sign off?

Speaker 2: 1:05:46

I don't think so. Except that thank you, I mean, for everything that you've done and continue to do, and I would just encourage people through these challenging times that we're in and they are, they are challenging to really focus on human connection when everybody else is focused on surviving is is to bridge across those in group and out groups, make a human connection even when it's uncomfortable, especially when it's uncomfortable and when all else fails. Just ask somebody to share their story and that alone can bridge almost every situation that we face. An open-ended question that starts with what or how and lets the other party tell you their story, and then just listen with the interest and intention and curiosity of a two-year-old and everything else will sort itself out.

Speaker 1: 1:06:35

Amen, scott. Thank you again so much for joining me today. Everyone, make sure you go check out the links in the show notes below. Follow along, let's go ahead and get last out into Houston. All right, all right.

Speaker 2: 1:06:47

Sounds good, thank you once again.

Speaker 1: 1:06:48

I appreciate you, sir, my pleasure you.